Thursday, March 03, 2011

Intense Exchange with Sedevacantist Anna Anahit Paitian

By Dave Armstrong (3-3-11)

This came about as a result of the previous (posted) exchange on this topic that was a private Facebook group e-mail. But this time it is a public thread on Anna's Facebook wall, so I am at liberty to post both sides, for teaching purposes [ah, but I am not, according to Anna: see below]. I do admire people with zeal for a cause, and passion, so in a weird sort of way I like (even on one level, respect) Anna, even though I think she is dead wrong, and indeed, sinning greatly in her false accusations against the Holy Father and more than one billion Catholics.

Her words exhibited in droves the leading traits and hyper-irrational judgmentalism of sedevacantism (the notion that there is no present valid pope). True dialogue was scarcely possible, but I implore all reading this to pray and do penance for this woman and for all the people sadly trapped in this hideous, absurd belief-system. They're victims. All falsehood and lies and false accusations come from below. We can choose to be taken in by them (to adopt false premises and build houses of sand and mud) and go our own way, or to be led to the fullness of Catholic truth and orthodoxy by God's grace and the indwelling Holy Spirit, and the guidance of Holy Mother Church and the Holy Bible and Sacred Tradition.

Anna decided she was opposed to my posting of her words (that I openly announced on her wall). She wrote there: "You did not ask a permission to post our personal conversation on a different page other than my wall, for all my about 5 thousand friends ONLY are allowed to see it. It is a violation of copyright indeed. You are adamant to make money using all means, by all ways possible. I am eliminating you from my friends’ list."

Very well, then (par for the course; the last guy who defriended me was a Mormon, and he had the same "anti-dialogical mentality). Previously, all Anna's words in the discussion were present here, so people could read both sides in their own words and make up their minds. Since she insists on objecting to this, and not having the courage of her convictions under scrutiny, I'll remove her words, but paraphrase the key tidbits. Even 5000 is no small number, to be reading a pack of lies about the Holy Father and fellow Catholics like myself.

But it is untrue (in her case, at any rate) that only her (almost) 5000 friends can see what is posted on her wall. I went back to her page after I was defriended and I can still see everything; I just can't reply any longer. So far, she has retained my comments in the thread. A lot more than 5000 or so "friends" can see and read her judgmental nonsense against the Church and myself. It's public material. All these friends can also spread it by sharing. Therefore, I have every right to quote at least some (if not all) of it, since every accused person has the right to defend himself, and since (far, far more importantly) I defend Holy Mother Church as my occupation.

I'll partially abide by her wishes, but I will cite her harshest words since they are indeed public, and no permission need necessarily be given for someone to publicly reply to public material, of a most unsavory nature. As a former journalist, surely Anna knows this full well.

Anna's words will be paraphrased in blue, in brackets, with her actual words cited in quotation marks.

* * * * *

[the basis of Vatican II is "Chardin’s theory of neo-theosophy"; men can become gods and Christ. Vatican II denied the "Redemption and Divinity of Jesus" and is a "Neo-Freemasonic system"]

Really [men can become God]? Where does Vatican II teach this?

[Anna refused to give a citation from the "agnostic-neo-pagan" Council. I am a "a vessel of dishonor" [2 Tim 2:20] in the "anti-Church" and so wouldn't accept the profound truth Anna has for me anyway. We can choose "any sin" in this "hell" that is the post-Vatican II Church]

This is utterly absurd and pathetic. You make a claim that Vatican II teaches so-and-so, yet you refuse to document. Words mean nothing to you, I guess. You're just ranting and raving and not being reasonable at all. This is sinful. If you lie about Holy Mother Church that is a serious sin, and you need to repent of it. You're letting the devil speak through you when you "reason" in this way, because he is the father of lies. I say this in love, for your own good. You are on spiritually dangerous ground.

Benedict XVI wasn't pope during Vatican II. I am talking about that Council. If you want to make lying claims, then at least attempt to document, lest you look like a total raving zealot for a lost cause.

You talk about sin that is imaginary, yet here you are lying with every other sentence, speaking falsehood about Holy Mother Church and the Holy Father and trying to spread it. For the love of God, please consider what you are doing! What has brought you to this sad state?

[I can "NOT" speak for the Church because I am one of the "children of Babylon’s harlot together with your gang- godfather popes." "Obviously" my "critical thinking ability is so weak/absent" and I am blind to the reality because I am "in denial, as a true breed of the devil, " with no "love for apostolic Church." The Catholic Church has been "hijacked by homosexuals and prostitutes, by fornicators with demons , by criminals who have NO CONNECTION with Christ". Two links given that supposedly prove this: [link 1] [link 2]. But of course I won't read them because I "don’t care about Roman Catholic Church and faith"; I am only out for "double talk and contradiction as a Satan". Anna asked me: "are you a pedophile? Confess and give you up to authorities. Then there will be a hope for you." No one who cares about God "can stay even one second in that filth called Novus Ordo"]

Are you insane? [rhetorical question in response to the absurd and outrageous question] I don't think I've ever seen anything so ridiculous in my 30 years of apologetics. You take the cake.

I will pray very hard for you and do penance as well. Lent is coming up. What better time to do so? You need serious help. May God rescue you from your misery.

You can despise me all you like and I'll love you right back Anna, by praying for you and telling you the truth.

I've been called just about everything in the book in my rounds as an apologist (it's an occupational hazard), but never a pedophile. That's a first. Just when I think I've been insulted with every imaginable name, someone tops it. :-)

[Anna then warned me about being a writer and being subject to God's judgment for the words we write (something I am quite intensely aware of, and always have been). She renounced most of her own past written work, saying, "90% of my writings was nothing but utter blasphemy . . . I burned publicly about 2000 pages of my manuscripts" and urged that I do the same, since I "present a wrong Catholicity and hypocritical love, which is not of God." She also warned me to avoid "popularity, which is a trap for any soul" and stated that "Out of 12 apostles only Judas was highly learned man, a scholar, a poet, a linguist - And he was the only one who burns right now in eternal fire."]

My books aren't 90% blasphemy, like yours were. Don't project your problems onto me. Mine are orthodox. Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. thought so (Foreword for my first book), and he is held in very high regard and was a holy, saintly man.

I've been defending Holy Mother Church for 20 years and proclaiming the fullness of Catholic truth, and defending Christianity against all enemies for 30 years. That's my history. Yours is your own.

I don't think you "hate" me, but you are lying about me and about the Church, and that is the opposite of love. Falsehood comes from below. You are a prisoner of false premises and false conclusions built upon them.

God has many ways to keep me humble. I'm constantly insulted: by anti-Catholic Protestants, by people like you, by atheists, by Catholic liberals. I was again blasted on a popular anti-Catholic webcast just a few days ago. I get very little earthly glory. I have to often live like a pauper because Catholic evangelism and apologetics are not regarded very highly by the world (or many in the Church, either), and so are not supported.

I'm not on TV, radio; don't do lecture tours. All of those things could possibly (but not necessarily) lead to pride, but since I don't do them, I avoid pridefulness as a result of those things.

Again, my past is not yours. I can see a beautiful person inside of your quite difficult exterior, and a person who has suffered much. You don't need to be trapped inside of this false sedevacantist trap. You can free your soul by accepting the authority of Holy Mother Church once again and letting the Holy Spirit heal your wounds and bring you back to a place of joy and peace and contentment. You're no prophetess: much as you may fancy yourself to be.

You are a wounded individual. Let God love you. Let others inside of your soul. Let the pain out. I would be your friend, if you'd stop regarding me as Satan, a pedophile, a prideful apologist, etc. I want what's best for you and your life. That's what love is.

[Anna called Pope Benedict XVI "a SATANIST. 100%"]

[replying to someone else] When I said "are you insane?" that was a rhetorical response to "are you a pedophile?" I don't think Anna is literally insane. I think she is a greatly suffering victim of false premises and the bitterness that comes from believing in falsehood (sedevacantism and conspiratorialist nonsense). False doctrines and opinions have dire consequences for souls. [it seems that Anna removed this post, or it was a Facebook glitch. I had preserved it on this page]

Of the wider range of apostles, of course Luke was a doctor and St. Paul was very learned: some think he could have been one of the great philosophers of his time, had he chosen to do so.

Extreme thinking like this will get you nowhere, Anna. You are wrong. You need healing. You need to yield to the Holy Spirit. I am saying this out of love. I have the gift of discernment (confirmed many many times). I can see what is happening here. You are wounded and suffering, and lashing out as a result, therefore harming yourself even more.

[Anna denied any "bitterness" and said, "I am as joyful in my life as a morning sunshine, . . . No one tells about me as ‘bitter’- on the contrary. ‘Idiot’ -yes, ‘happy freak’- yes…my neighbors hear nothing but piano and singing from my house…You are the angry and bitter one". We were informed that "Vatican II has nothing to do with true Catholicity, B16 DOES NOT BELIEVE in Creed he recites…He is a fake, and you are". Then she took a different tack: "Btw, you are a learned man, and you don’t know that communion you take in your fake church is not even consecrated? After 1968 all consecrations are turned into Anglican rite, which INVALID and under anathema . . . Ha,ha, ha…How pathetic! What a loser!"]

I also receive Holy Communion at the Tridentine rite that we have in my parish. Are those valid, Anna?

"Ha ha ha"? You sure show the fruit of the Holy Spirit in your mocking and derision . . .

[Anna replied that the Tridentine Mass is also "INVALID" if it "is not a CANONIZED MASS of pre-1962."]



GADEL said...

I've known Anna for sometime now on FB and I believe she is a sincere but "deluded" person. All Sedes are deluded sort of.

scotju said...

I do not understand why you waste your time on these sedevacanists. Hardly anyone knows about them, and their influence in the Church is nil. Liberalism, atheism, evolution, Islam, and hedonism are the main internal and external foes of the Church today, not some obscure nutcases out in the boondocks.

Dave Armstrong said...

I was in the situation (being added to a mailing list), so I responded with truth, since that is my duty as an apologist. I don't seek them out.

I could say the same thing about geocentrists, but they sure want to talk and interact and they think they are on the cutting edge of Catholicism. All errors need to be confronted at some point.

Evolution itself is no kind of enemy; materialism is. If evolution is seen in materialistic terms it is an enemy, but because it has removed God. Theistic evolution is fully allowed by the Church, whether you like it or not.

Br. Bruno said...

I just wanted to mention that link 1 and link 2 go to the same place

Dave Armstrong said...


Victoria said...

I have to often live like a pauper because Catholic evangelism and apologetics are not regarded very highly by the world (or many in the Church, either), and so are not supported.

Dave, if being a Catholic evangelist/apologist is keeping you from making enough money to pay the bills and feed your family - your children, I imagine will want to go to college, - then maybe you might have to get a full time job and do the apologetics part time. Mary Beth Bonnacci is a Realtor.

Dave Armstrong said...

Everything's fine at the moment. God does provide, which is why I keep doing this, but it remains a fact that Christian full-time work is not valued much in our society. Out of the thousands who have read my stuff and use it fairly regularly, only a few feel led to support it financially, even though many know that I do this work full-time.

That holds true even for many who say my work directly led to their conversion or return to the Church.

I worked at another full-time job in the 90s and did this part-time. Since 2001 it has been reversed. The biggest factor now in any struggles I do have, is Obama and the economy. It's because of him that I lost my part-time job. I was doing really well before that.

But God continues to provide. Various things are happening now to get me back on a more sure financial footing again. God is good!